Sven Slootweg (soft-deprecated) @joepie91@pixie.town

@serapath @joelving @powersource I'm trying to get you to actually reason through the steps of what that 'crackdown' might look like and what would happen if you refuse to cooperate, rather than just saying "network effect" as some sort of magical incantation with inherent power (which it doesn't have; it needs an enforcement mechanism).

@serapath @joelving @powersource As I have explained several times now, you can keep using the old currency and only use the new currency with those who also accept it, and exchange between the two as needed - money has an interoperability that social networks do not.

You claim that that would be "cracked down upon" and I am still asking you *how* that would happen, because social convention alone does not make that possible.

Social networks have control over user account suspension and their APIs, and can limit interoperability, and that's how they can crack down on gradual transitions. Governments do not have that control over money.

So, how do they do it?

@PastaThief Would something like Drip (https://bloodyhealth.gitlab.io/) not be a safer recommendation because it is entirely local to your phone, and so never goes to any server anywhere to begin with?

(Given that things in Germany aren't going that great either)

@serapath @powersource I really, really am not interested in this discussion.

@serapath @joelving @powersource No, it is not. The network effect only applies for cases where a gradual transition is not viable. This is not one of those, if it works as you describe. So that isn't the answer either.

@serapath @joelving @powersource Again, "buying power" is a social convention that hinges on people accepting 'their' money as legitimate, so that's not the answer.

So *how* are they cracking down? What form of power do they have that cannot be trivially opposed?

@serapath @powersource And to be clear, I have absolutely no intention of following the usual "look at how great Bitcoin is" playbook. I've tried to argue these things with people for literal years, and I am done. It is a waste of your time and mine.

@serapath @powersource I am not going to watch Bitcoin propaganda. I am very well aware of the tendency for enthusiasts to selectively spread around 'success stories' while being suspiciously quiet about the failure stories. I am extremely close to the cryptocurrency world and I know what the true dynamics are.

@serapath @joelving @powersource That is not the correct answer. If that were the answer, nothing would stop people from transitioning, because none of it exists in any way other than through social convention.

So what's the actual way in which capitalists can crack down on alternative currencies?

@serapath @powersource Yes, adoption has shrunk over time. But to be honest I don't think this conversation is going anywhere, you seem far too invested in believing that Bitcoin is doing well.

(And I say this as an early adopter who *to this day* continues to be paid in BTC by a customer, and continuously experiences the frustrations of dealing with it)

@serapath @joelving @powersource There's a reason I brought up exchanging - if what you say is correct, then it should simply be a matter of exchanging to whichever currency you need for a given transaction. Annoying, sure, but doable. It could even be automated.

So. Why isn't that happening? That's the question I'm asking.

And "it gets cracked down on by capitalists" is getting closer to the answer, but it is not the full answer. *HOW* does it get cracked down on? What is ultimately the thing that gives capitalists the power to crack down on this?

@thomas A lot of people seem to be scavenging 'disposable' vapes (which often contain rechargeable li-ion).