@sofia@chaos.social To clarify, when I say 'democracy' here, I'm following the 'common understanding' of what that means when talking to the general population - specifically, the factors that are supposed to lead to a "just government that represents the people", which is what people usually mean.

Like, when someone says "democratic outcome", what they mean is generally something along the lines of "this is what the people have chosen, it is what the people want", and for that a number of properties (those of a 'liberal democracy') must hold true.

Do *I* believe that that model of democracy works in practice? No, not really, as evidenced here. But that is the language that people speak when they say "democratic outcome", and agreeing with that frame means that you will be perceived as agreeing with that *model*, even if you mean something very different.

And *by the rules of a liberal democracy*, I do not believe that the Netherlands is a functioning democracy, and I do not believe that it has been for a long time.